Post by NoddyPost by Trevor WilsonPost by DarylSon was in Shenzhen China a couple of weeks ago, he said that he
stopped counting the number of different EV brands he saw after he
got to 40.
We see very few of those brands here because our market is too small
to bother with.
**And, no one wants to import a car where the manufacturer is likely
to cease to exist in a few years.
The majority of Chinese vehicles would be unlikely to ever meet our
compliance requirements.
The ones coming here obviously do!
Post by NoddyPost by Trevor WilsonPost by DarylSounds like the Chinese are copying what the Japanese did, enter the
market with very low prices then when they win a big chunk of the
market prices go up very significantly.
**Nope. Completely different strategies. The Japanese conquered the
* Building quality, RELIABLE vehicles. In the case of Toyota, they
ensured that there were suitable repair facilities across Australia,
when the Land Cruiser was first imported here.
Do you make this bullshit up as you go, or what? :)
C'mon Darren, the only one here who makes shit up is *you*!
And you do it a lot!
Post by NoddyThe Japanese made their name in the automotive world by making cheap
junk, and the Land cruiser was no exception. It was first imported into
Australia in the late 1950's as the BJ25 model to compete with the Land
Rover, and at the time it was an unreliable heap of shit. Nor was it
supported by an extensive dealer network. That came *much* later.
The BJ25 was *privately* imported into Australia by Thiess, a company
into mining and construction projects, and used on their projects.
Thiess himself was so impressed by them that he applied for and was
granted a dealership franchise arrangement.
The Land Cruiser was never an unreliable heap of shit. The advent of the
Toyota Land Cruiser into Australia was the reason why the Land Rover all
but disappeared from the mining scene and the main reason was
*reliability*. The early BJ25's would break axles and gearboxes. So
what? Land Rovers were renown for breaking axles - nearly always the
short one. Back when I was an apprentice in the 60s, fishing broken
axles out of Land Rover's axle housings was *normal*.
The difference between Land Rover and Toyota, when the BJ25 broke a few
axles, the Japanese engineers came to Australia to sort out the issue
once and for all. None of the FJ40s in my home district ever broke an
axle - and they had the power and torque of a 6 cylinder engine twisting
them.
Post by NoddyPost by Trevor Wilson* Raising the cost of registration in Japan, such that buying a new
car was cheaper than owning an old one. This ensured a significant
local demand was installed.
Which had absolutely fuck nothing to do with anything *other* than the
Japanese domestic market.
The Japanese domestic market was the proving ground for the export market.
Post by NoddyPost by Trevor Wilson* Providing more 'fruit' in their cars than European, American and
Australian manufacturers could.
That they did, which is what got their foot in the door.
That and greater reliability than the Pommy vehicles they replaced.
Post by NoddyPost by Trevor Wilson* Building cars at lower prices, due to lower labour costs.
Not always :)
In the early days, yes, for sure.
Post by NoddyThe Japanese can be pretty ruthless people, and they thought nothing of
dumping products on our shores at very minimal margins, or even below
cost, in order to make life difficult for the local opposition.
Look up the saga of Ebeling Road Sweepers, and how a long established
business was wiped out by Japanese product dumping.
Post by Trevor Wilson* Outsourcing many components to tiny, backyard manufacturers, who
often work for minuscule income.
What "backyard" manufacturers did Toyota outsource to?
In Japan - lots. In Australia, not so much, just small companies - but a
lot of them.
Post by NoddyWhat they tended to do, and in particular Toyota who were World
Champions at it, was second, third and fourth source components from a
variety of manufacturers so as not to hold up production should one of
the third party suppliers suffer a problem that affected their ability
to supply.
Sounds sensible. Why wouldn't a car manufacturer have more than one
string for their bows?
Post by NoddyGreat for Toyota as it meant that cars kept plopping out the door, but a
pain in the arse for anyone fixing them when you had to work out which
one of three different alternators or starters the thing left the
factory with :)
Holden, Ford and Chrysler did exactly the same thing. Remember the
Holdens with either Bosch or Lucas bits? Oh, that's right, you were
still in short pants and getting bullied at Richmond Tech when that was
going on.
Post by NoddyPost by Trevor WilsonSome of those things no longer exist, but they did allow the Japanese
car manufacturers to become amongst the largest on the planet.
Eventually.
You're no doubt old enough to remember when there was a time where "Made
in Japan" was a saying that was as synonymous with cheap rubbish as
"Made in China is today, and their initial foray into the automotive
world was no different. Like a lot of today's Chinese vehicles, early
Japanese ones looked great on paper in terms of what they offered for
money, but were utter crap in service.
Hmmm, I recall a lot of old Datsun Bluebirds of the 60s that were way
better than the Pommy cars they were modelled on. You weren't even a
teenager then, what would you know! I was there, I worked on those cars.
Post by NoddyEarly Mazdas, Toyotas, Hondas and Datsuns were fucking *rubbish*. It
wasn't until the 1970's did they get their shit together, and in a way
Nah, the 60s were the good years. They were the cars *I worked on* when
they were very new cars. They were the reason we don't make cars here
any more - people got used to reliable cars.
Post by Noddythe Chinese are following suit. Not to the same extent that the Koreans
did who overcame their initial stumblings *very* quickly, but they're
getting there.
Bullshit - Hyundai/Kia are *still* stumbling.
Post by NoddyThe question is will they *ever* get there, and that's one that I'm not
sure about as the business ment
My god, looks like you abruptly stopped running off at the mouth!
--
Xeno
Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)